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 Post subject: .50 caliber
 Post Posted: Fri Sep 21, 2018 10:41 am 
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Happened to notice in a magazine an ad for a .50 caliber lever action rifle - caught my eye until I saw the price, about $2K. Far too much for me especially being lever action. I'm sure it's probably not the same bullet as the 50 bmg, but anything you shoot with it ought to drop in its tracks. That's a big plus in my book. Was told that they purposely stomach shot a deer with a 50 bmg and it dropper where it was, blew all the guts out - problem is these guns are too pricey.


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 Post subject: Re: .50 caliber
 Post Posted: Fri Sep 21, 2018 1:04 pm 
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troyo wrote:
purposely stomach shot a deer with a 50 bmg and it dropper where it was, blew all the guts out

Well I heard it doesn't just blow the guts out but will field dress it for you too.
I wouldn't hunt with a 50BMG because it is way overkill. If I flinch anticipating recoil and wound an animal it runs off. If I ease in to something more appropriate, I can expect less recoil and a well placed shot. No running animal. I did kill some hogs with my 50 cal muzzle-loader years ago and that was fun. My opinion, for me, it's better to put a 120-162 grain bullet right where it should be than to put a giant bullet where it shouldn't.


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 Post subject: Re: .50 caliber
 Post Posted: Mon Oct 01, 2018 8:59 pm 
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Killed a 150 pounder couple days ago right at dark - bullet went in where I wanted it to at slight angle (.308 with Barnes 168 gr tsx) - she dropped, then few seconds later jumped up and ran 20 yards and fell again so I shot again. I didn't expect that with this ammo - here is why I prefer a rreal knock their socks off load, which allows a little room for error in shot placement. Pros & cons, I know, individual preference. At my age I do not want a wounded hog to deal with, lol.


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 Post subject: Re: .50 caliber
 Post Posted: Tue Oct 02, 2018 3:47 pm 
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troyo wrote:
Killed a 150 pounder couple days ago right at dark - bullet went in where I wanted it to at slight angle (.308 with Barnes 168 gr tsx) - she dropped, then few seconds later jumped up and ran 20 yards and fell again so I shot again. I didn't expect that with this ammo - here is why I prefer a rreal knock their socks off load, which allows a little room for error in shot placement. Pros & cons, I know, individual preference. At my age I do not want a wounded hog to deal with, lol.


Did you recover the hog? And, if you did, how did the first shot perform? What did the necropsy show?

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 Post subject: Re: .50 caliber
 Post Posted: Tue Oct 02, 2018 5:16 pm 
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It was a pass thru & second shot which was hurried of course was thru the back & guts but she was very dead then lol. Talked to gun store owner today about it & he said basically no gun will guarantee a drop & never move but (as I said) the bigger bore you use the better chances of a dead right there - I know it's argumentive but hey if it runs off at least you knock off a pound of meat, lol.


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 Post subject: Re: .50 caliber
 Post Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 12:25 am 
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Some years back, when the pigs first started bothering the pastures of some relatives, I talked with a few of them and their friends to get an idea about how to hunt hogs. Those old boys were serious about shooting and hitting where you shot and bringing home the meat. One guy said his 22-250 only worked if he got a neck shot or a head shot. Another said shotguns didn't have the accuracy at the ranges you'd see, so not to bother with them.

I mentioned that I had a 30-06 and some 150 gr and 180 gr loads that shot well and asked if that'd work well enough for hogs. That caused a 2nd round of cans to be passed around and I was told that to stop a pig, you either shot it in the back of the head or the neck. I said I used a partitioned 150 gr bullet and the 180 gr was rated for elk. This caused a guy, Frank, I think, to laugh and say that elk bullets didn't stop hogs any faster. He then said that he and his friends had decided to see if they could find a caliber that could stop a hog with a heart and lung shot without it running off. He said that he'd personally shot a hog thru the shoulders at about 100 yds with a 338 Win Mag with a 225 gr elk rated bullet. He said it was a good shot, the bullet had expanded fairly quickly and had destroyed the heart and lungs passing on to leave a massive exit hole. Frank took a swing and said the hog ran across the field like normal except that it seemed to be pumping more blood out both sides like a firetruck with 2 hoses. They were trying next to get my relative to try out his Marlin 450 guide gun out; but, he claimed he was too wimpy to fire it much and nobody else wanted to barrow it for a test. They said they'd also like to see someone with a Barrett 50 BMG try a heart lung shot. (One fella' even said he's video that.)

(Background story: In 1975 I shot a spike buck at about 10 ft from the top of a cedar tree stand. I was using a hot load in 30-06 with a Sierra 150 gr spire point cup and core type bullet. The bullet entered the upper right of the base of it's neck and I found the totally inverted jacket under the skin near the front left armpit. The lead had expanded fast (@ about 3,000fps) and, you could say it basically exploded. Lead slivers shredded the chest cavity, penetrated the diaphragm and even shredded into the gut area. I've never seen a deader deer, but, I wanted a little bit better bullet to hold together. This is when I switched to Nosler Partitions, the front 40% expands fast for deer types and the 60% rear section penetrates, usually a shoot thru, and stays together. I've never had a deer take more than 1 step when hit reasonably close to target with this latter combination.)


Image

When my youngest son got out of the Corps after Iraq, my older son and I took him on his 1st hog hunt (along with their cousin who had just gotten out of the Air Force.) We had rain on and off thru the night to make it fun. I drove them down the pastures to branch, now filling with water, which blocked the truck and dropped the 3 off. My older son guided them down the pasture road in the next field in the rain. At a point where the woods came close to the road, there was noise. My youngest was using my old A3-03 Springfield. He turned on the shooting light and found that they were in the middle of the sounder. A sow of about 80 lbs was pointed and staring at him to his front at about 20 feet. He quickly aimed and fires; the bullet entered center chest and exited at the rear. The sow flopped down, all 4 legs popping almost straight to her sides. About 10 seconds later, she popped up and began running in circles around the boys. Their cousin was hunting with his Dad's uncleaned Marlin 30-30 and jammed a round as he worked the level to chamber a round. My youngest chamber a 2nd round, and, in a historic Hog Hunter's voice yelled "Die Hog" and fired the second shot which dropped the sow. Neither shot was a head or neck shot.

Image


Lesson Learned: If you don't want to see a hog run, it's a head or neck shot that breaks the neck. I would like to see results from a large caliber tho... :)

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 Post subject: Re: .50 caliber
 Post Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 8:20 am 
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I looked at a .35 Whelen yesterday all i've read on it is good except some complain of recoil - i checked the revoil chsrt & it compares to a 16 guage shotgun (i shoot 12 guage both 3 & 3&1/2" magnums). Adding weight inside the synthetic dtock also reduces recoil. I msy just ude my 06 with barnes 180 gr tho


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 Post subject: Re: .50 caliber
 Post Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 4:48 pm 
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With hogs, shot placement is king. The hog will die if you hit him in the heart and lungs, but he will run a ways. To anchor a hog drt, you gotta disrupt the nervous system. A high shoulder shot, neck shot, base of the ear. Either of those will disrupt the spinal chord and drop a hog drt. If you're bow hunting, get a quartering away shot, with near leg forward, and aim for the arm pit. You'll hit heart/lungs. The pig will die, but it will run a ways. By hitting him low quartering away you should have a good blood trail to follow.

On smaller hogs, say less than 150lbs, you can get away with some less than perfect shots and sometimes anchor the pig. With the big boys though, you gotta hit them right or they'll run a long ways. And, don't underestimate a large boars shield. I've personally seen a boars shield deflect a 130grn Remington Core Loct from a .270 Winchester. My wife shot a large boar, and the bullet hit about half way up in line with the front leg. The bullet did NOT penetrate the shield. It went into the shield just a touch, and then veered forward, and ended up lodging in the hogs neck up against it's spine, between two vertebrae. The hog dropped, but was still alive when I got to it. I finished it with a shot from my .44 mag in the head. Her shot was at about 80yrds or so, and slightly quartering away. The boars shield was over two inches thick. Plus the hog had a lot of dried mud on his shield. It sure made it hard for that bullet to penetrate.

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Marty

http://www.feederlights.com/
The BEST HOG HUNTING LIGHTS.
http://www.inheatscents.net/
The BEST HOG HUNTING SCENTS.


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 Post subject: Re: .50 caliber
 Post Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 9:57 pm 
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Marty is right. I've shot hogs with a .375 H&H, and if you don't hit them just right, they still run as much as 100 yards.


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 Post subject: Re: .50 caliber
 Post Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 11:17 pm 
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BurtG wrote:
Marty is right. I've shot hogs with a .375 H&H, and if you don't hit them just right, they still run as much as 100 yards.
Powerful argument for a large bore, I'd say! When u hunt in the brush ur NOT always gonna get that perfect shot do u need as much margin of error on ur side as possible / sure if ur hunting open fields as we see so much of in videos, being 200+ yards away, u can use a much smaller bote, take ur time & eait for the perfect shot / smell, hearing & sight are removed from that situation as well as trees, limbs & brush & other obstacles which have to be dealt with at close range. Wait long & u will get busted / u bettr bust him fast at close range


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 Post subject: Re: .50 caliber
 Post Posted: Thu Oct 04, 2018 9:34 am 
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troyo wrote:
BurtG wrote:
Marty is right. I've shot hogs with a .375 H&H, and if you don't hit them just right, they still run as much as 100 yards.
Powerful argument for a large bore, I'd say! When u hunt in the brush ur NOT always gonna get that perfect shot do u need as much margin of error on ur side as possible / sure if ur hunting open fields as we see so much of in videos, being 200+ yards away, u can use a much smaller bote, take ur time & eait for the perfect shot / smell, hearing & sight are removed from that situation as well as trees, limbs & brush & other obstacles which have to be dealt with at close range. Wait long & u will get busted / u bettr bust him fast at close range


Even with a large bore, shot placement is key to cleanly taking a hog. Up close and personal in the brush the large bore rifles might be a bit better at getting through the brush, but you still gotta hit the hog right. On big boars, that's especially true. They're tough animals.

I hear a lot of guys scoff at that statement. They'll say "I've killed hundreds with a .223/5.56", or "I've shot and killed countless hogs with a .22" "They ain't that tough!". My response is always "OK, that is great". Where'd ya hittem?

If you hit a hog and disrupt his central nervous system they WILL go down. If all you did was shock the spinal chord, they WILL get back up and run. To anchor one drt you gotta do damage to the central nervous system that they can't recover from. And, a .22 can do that at close range. I have killed bunches of them out of traps with a .22 long rifle in a pistol. It works at close range when you put a slug in their ear, or neck. Would I ever recommend the .22 as a good hog cartridge? Heck no. I don't recommend the .223/5.56 as a good hog cartridge either, but that round still kills a lot of hogs for folks. There are far better cartridges for hunting hogs.

For years my bolt gun in 30-06 was my hog and deer slayer. It killed with monotonous reliability. Virtually nothing got away from that rifle. As long as I hit the boiler room, or central nervous system or any animal, it was mine. I don't ever recall not recovering an animal that I hit with that rifle. So, why don't I use it all the time? I wanted something new, exciting, and fun to shoot and hunt with. Enter the AR's. There are so many variables with them, mods you can do, triggers you can use, forearms, stocks, receiver sets, barrels, calibers.....the list goes on and on. It's made shooting and hunting fun for me again. I've gotten to an age where having fun shooting and hunting is important to me. My bolt gun is still in the safe. It still shoots good. It'll still kill game dead, but it doesn't excite me like the AR's do. It doesn't get my blood pumping like the AR's do.

That old bolt rifle will get passed down to one of my kids, or grand kids. And, I'm sure it'll still be killing game into the future.

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Happy hunting,
Marty

http://www.feederlights.com/
The BEST HOG HUNTING LIGHTS.
http://www.inheatscents.net/
The BEST HOG HUNTING SCENTS.


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 Post subject: Re: .50 caliber
 Post Posted: Thu Oct 04, 2018 3:43 pm 
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Thanks, Marty! I will probably go with my 06 because its an autoloader - the trigger pull is bad on it but at close range i can get by with it. Would u recommend the barnes tsx 180 gr - little dilemma as i understand it - they sre great for big hogs & larger animals but for deer & smaller hogs they may not expand as much - will probably use them because u nevr know when a big one will show up


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 Post subject: Re: .50 caliber
 Post Posted: Thu Oct 04, 2018 5:40 pm 
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troyo wrote:
Thanks, Marty! I will probably go with my 06 because its an autoloader - the trigger pull is bad on it but at close range i can get by with it. Would u recommend the barnes tsx 180 gr - little dilemma as i understand it - they sre great for big hogs & larger animals but for deer & smaller hogs they may not expand as much - will probably use them because u nevr know when a big one will show up


I have limited experience with the 180 TSX, but I'd think that bullet was more designed for 300WM velocities. I'd go down a size to 168 TTSX or 165 TSX. I know in .308 the 130 TSX's are used regularly. I'm personally gonna use 168 TTSX's this year in my .308.

I'd be afraid the 180grn may not open reliably with the slower velocities. Like I said though, I don't have any experience with that bullet.

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Happy hunting,
Marty

http://www.feederlights.com/
The BEST HOG HUNTING LIGHTS.
http://www.inheatscents.net/
The BEST HOG HUNTING SCENTS.


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 Post subject: Re: .50 caliber
 Post Posted: Thu Oct 04, 2018 5:42 pm 
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The great thing about Barnes TSX bullets is their monolithic, and don't typically break up. So, even the light weight bullets tend to penetrate good.

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Marty

http://www.feederlights.com/
The BEST HOG HUNTING LIGHTS.
http://www.inheatscents.net/
The BEST HOG HUNTING SCENTS.


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 Post subject: Re: .50 caliber
 Post Posted: Thu Oct 04, 2018 5:50 pm 
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I use the barnes tsx 168 gr now in my 308 bolt action - was hoping the 180 gr in 06 would be more of a stopper - oh well, lol


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 Post subject: Re: .50 caliber
 Post Posted: Fri Oct 05, 2018 8:23 am 
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troyo wrote:
I use the barnes tsx 168 gr now in my 308 bolt action - was hoping the 180 gr in 06 would be more of a stopper - oh well, lol


I went with the 168 TTSX in my .308 as well. If I change it will be to go down to the 130grn. From what I understand you can reload that and get some screaming velocities, with great expansion, and still get awesome penetration. If the 168's don't make me happy, the 130's will be next.

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http://www.feederlights.com/
The BEST HOG HUNTING LIGHTS.
http://www.inheatscents.net/
The BEST HOG HUNTING SCENTS.


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 Post subject: Re: .50 caliber
 Post Posted: Fri Oct 05, 2018 11:41 am 
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mley1 wrote:
troyo wrote:
I use the barnes tsx 168 gr now in my 308 bolt action - was hoping the 180 gr in 06 would be more of a stopper - oh well, lol


I went with the 168 TTSX in my .308 as well. If I change it will be to go down to the 130grn. From what I understand you can reload that and get some screaming velocities, with great expansion, and still get awesome penetration. If the 168's don't make me happy, the 130's will be next.
please keep me podted on ur findings - i'm not into ballistics like u are - i thought the larger grain would be better but ur saying smaller may be - i jus want the best "drt" shell for close range shooting - thanks


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 Post subject: Re: .50 caliber
 Post Posted: Sun Oct 07, 2018 8:00 am 
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troyo wrote:
mley1 wrote:
troyo wrote:
I use the barnes tsx 168 gr now in my 308 bolt action - was hoping the 180 gr in 06 would be more of a stopper - oh well, lol


I went with the 168 TTSX in my .308 as well. If I change it will be to go down to the 130grn. From what I understand you can reload that and get some screaming velocities, with great expansion, and still get awesome penetration. If the 168's don't make me happy, the 130's will be next.
please keep me podted on ur findings - i'm not into ballistics like u are - i thought the larger grain would be better but ur saying smaller may be - i jus want the best "drt" shell for close range shooting - thanks


Troyo, those larger bullets are typically designed to open at faster velocities. In the .308 that can be problematic. The .308 is a stubby cartridge. So, the 180 TTSX Barnes is a long bullet. Monolithic bullets tend to be longer in the same weight size as a lead bullet. Lead, being heavier than copper, will have shorter bullets in the same weight ranges as the monolithics. So, a 168grn lead bullet will be shorter than a 168grn monolithic. This means that a 180grn TTSX will be protruding more into the case than a regular 180grn lead bullet. This extra protrusion in the case will limit powder capacity some. Lower powder capacity equals lower velocity, all things being equal.

Another issue with the longer 180 grain monolithic will be coa. To get the seated bullet and cartridge into a magazine of a semi auto .308 that long of a bullet will be protruding much farther into the case. Thus, limiting powder capacity. Limited powder capacity equals limited velocity, and limits the ranges at which that bullet will expand.

The loads I'm using in my .308 with the 168grn TTSX are at or near max. The bullet is right on top of the powder. I don't think it's compressing it much, if at all. It is a hot load in my rifle. Always approach any loads with caution. I'm getting an average of 2562fps in a five shot string. 44.7grn of Varget, Federal cases, Winchester large rifle primers, small base full length sizing. My reloads shoot to the same poi as factory Barnes 168grn loads. I'm pretty confident these will do well. Only killing some animals will tell me. We shall see.

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Happy hunting,
Marty

http://www.feederlights.com/
The BEST HOG HUNTING LIGHTS.
http://www.inheatscents.net/
The BEST HOG HUNTING SCENTS.


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 Post subject: Re: .50 caliber
 Post Posted: Sun Oct 07, 2018 12:30 pm 
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Barnes bullets tend to work better the faster they go.
A 130 grain can go about 3,000 fps in the .308 as I recall.


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 Post subject: Re: .50 caliber
 Post Posted: Sun Oct 07, 2018 3:20 pm 
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BurtG wrote:
Barnes bullets tend to work better the faster they go.
A 130 grain can go about 3,000 fps in the .308 as I recall.


That's what I was trying to explain to Troyo. With the 180 that he asked about it would be difficult to get enough powder in the .308 case to push it fast enough to perform like it's supposed to. It would probably end up acting like an fmj.

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Happy hunting,
Marty

http://www.feederlights.com/
The BEST HOG HUNTING LIGHTS.
http://www.inheatscents.net/
The BEST HOG HUNTING SCENTS.


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